Hello there as looking maybe to get some help. I made petition to the lodge a year ago and well its almost time for me to go back and re petition again. Any how last time it was stopped for reason I dont know if I was black balled or if it was stopped in committee for some reason. My father is a past master at this lodge I want to join. He no longer lives here so he doesnt get to sit lodge with the old guys. On the petition last time where it asks have you been arrested I put no because I was a juvenile when I got in trouble and didnt think nothing of it. I talked with my father about it and he told me I need to put yes on there and tell them what happened and that it was juvenile and that it was dismissed. Ill be frank though I was with a guy who had drugs on him and they arrested both of us and well as said the charges against me were later dismissed, I was in the wrong place and wrong time. I know it was my fault for what happened and I realize that. The only other thing that I have is I had to file for Chapter 13 bankruptcy back in 2009 due to some financial harships. The payment comes out of my paycheck and well everything is fine now im building my finances back up where they were at prior to back surgery and everything. So I know I can meet my obligations my question is how does this all look to you if you were the ones investigating. Most of the guys in the lodge they do know me and of course Im going to be a little embarrased when they ask me have I ever been bankrupt.
Any thoughts also could my last petition with the ommited information have got it turned down.
The important question here…and you’ve asked it…is how this would look to me if I were the one investigating.
If I was investigating you, I would most likely never have met you, but would just get a copy of your application that I can use to contact your references and do my investigation. If you didn’t disclose certain things on the application, and then they came to light during the investigation, that would be worrying for me as an investigator.
However, if those same items were listed and explained on the application, I would be expecting that they might come out in the investigation, and I would not be nearly as surprised to hear them, making the result of the investigation more favorable.
If it were ME making the decision, and if I had all the information, I’d be much more inclined to return your investigation favorably if I you shared everything and showed that you’ve made improvements in your life for the better.
Based on the information you provided here, I can’t see any reason why you would be excluded from membership.
Thanks for the reply. Yes that pretty much sums it up with me. The trouble in the past has been 11 years ago and well as said it was all dismissed and the records were destroyed. I guess sometimes life is the best teacher and learning from our mistakes help make us the person we are today. Ive been wanting to join for a while and I see the kind of person my dad is and other Masons that I have met and all seem to be good people. Ive been searching for light for a long time and well its hard when you go at it alone.
The issues are really not that complicated. To begin with, the bankruptcy is not an issue. I know of no masonic rules that address the issue of a petitioner being, or having once been, bankrupt and can’t imagine a committee member asking about it. If you were asked, you simply give the facts.
Regarding the arrest issue, you must give a truthful answer to the investigator, however the question is put. If you are asked if you have ever been convicted of a crime (which is how it is nearly always put in our jurisdiction), you can truthfully answer no, since the matter was dismissed. If the question is whether you have ever been arrested, you would have to answer yes. In either case, you should give a brief explanation and state the facts. It is then up to the investigating committee and the lodge to decide if this is grounds to reject your petition. I don’t think most lodges would, if the committee feels that this was just a youthful mistake and you are now a man they would like to have as a brother.
The worst thing you can do is to lie. If the committee finds out that you did, you will never be accepted. If they don’t find out, and you become a member of the lodge, and at some future time it becomes known that you lied on your petition or to the committee, you could (and probably would) be charged with unmasonic conduct and expelled.
In short, be honest and open, and trust the instincts of the brothers.
Thank you Mr. Young. The last time I petitioned I was asked have I even been bankrupt and well at that time I had not. I will be submitting another petition in OCT which is when the year is up from the other one. I appreciate all the answers and well think I will hang around here for a while.
The only other thing I guess that I thought of is I had a son out of wedlock and I am involved in a interacial marriage and I am in the south so I dont know how that will sit with other members of the lodge.
The only other thing I guess that I thought of is I had a son out of wedlock and I am involved in a interacial marriage and I am in the south so I dont know how that will sit with other members of the lodge.
On THAT I can only add that having a son out of wedlock is not a crime, nor is it anyone’s business. The interacial marriage thing…once again…who cares? Heck, I can think of several interacial marriages in my lodge alone.
However, that said, I live in Massachusetts. MA isn’t known for it’s stance on traditional marriage values, and it sure as heck isn’t known for being a racist state. Being in the south, you may encounter more resistance from well meaning men who think your personal family choices are somehow their business. To that I can only say that I hope your lodge doesn’t behave that way.
To be honest, I’m a little concerned that a Past Master’s son would need to apply more than once.
I appreciate the comments. I hope that they dont hold it against me. As said I dont know what stopped the petition last time maybe it was because something came up about my juvneile arrest I have no idea. Ill shoot you a PM if you dont mind as some things dont need to be aired in the open :).
I am very much surprised that you did not receive any response to your petition; it’s not proper procedure. You should have received a letter from the lodge informing you either that your petition was accepted and giving further details about what to do next; or that your petition was rejected and enclosing a check for the fee that you submitted with it (if any). These are the only two possible courses of action, and should have been taken within two or three months of the time you submitted the petition.
What you submitted to the lodge was a petition, not an application, for membership. There is a difference in these terms. An application (for a job, for credit, etc.) is a request that presumes that you have a right to favorable consideration in the absence of any factors which would properly result in a refusal, for which you are entitled to an explanation. A petition is a request for action ex gratia, which means that you have no right to favorable consideration, that it is entirely at the discretion of the recipient to make a decision either way without any explanation, and none is ever given. If your petition was, in fact, rejected, no explanation will be given, ever.
Regarding your marriage and child, as has been noted above, that is properly your business and should not be a factor in considering your suitability for lodge membership. However, there is no denying that most lodges have some older members who hold to the ideas prevalent in their younger days and they have the ability to cast a blackball. You just have to accept that that’s how they were brought up and they have their rights as members. Moreover, they may not be just ugly racists; they may well be honorable and very decent men, just unable to adjust to the more enlightened standards of today’s world. (I have known a number of such men.) You can only hope that you don’t have any problems with this. If you do, you have the right to apply to another lodge in due time, but you will have to inform them that you have been rejected by a lodge and give the details, leaving out the reason, because you will never know the actual reason. I wish you good luck.
Thank you Mr young. I did recieve a letter from the lodge stating that my petition was denied. And I agree with you sometimes another mans views is something I might not agree with but it is something that we have to deal with in this world. I plan on to keep filing a petition every year until I either pass on or they accept me which ever comes first but be assured they will have to look at me every year and turn it down if they see fit. I can only live my life on the basic principles we should all live by whether I am a member of the lodge or not and one being take care of my fellow man. I think it will all work out one day I can only hope that they judge me on the person I am today and not past actions or the reationship that my heart chose.
Good for you, Brian. I think you have the right attitude. I encourage you to keep trying. From my experience, I think you will almost certainly be a member sooner or later. I can’t say this from what happens in my lodge, since we have rejected less than a half dozen petitions in the last 30 years, and none have reapplied, but I know several men who were originally rejected and were accepted on a second try. I think that when a man reapplies after being rejected, it sets up within the lodge one of two attitudes: if the man is obviously a no goodnik, it hardens the members’ attitude at his presumption; if the man isn’t obviously a bad apple (and I think this is your case), they are inclined to give him credit for perseverance and whoever gave a bad report or cast a blackball will be inclined to reassess his former judgment.
Have you had your father call some old friends at the lodge and inquire about your rejection? I think it would be easier to address their concerns if you knew what they were. In PA, it used to be one black ball to block a petitioner, now it’s 3 or a trip to the DDGM. Anyway, good luck with your petition.
Hi there.
I hope the brothers here answered your questions. I would like to add one comment: Just because your petition does not go forward does not automatically mean it’s a problem with your past. Sometimes it’s the present. Every lodge is different,and not everyone "fits" with every Lodge. You have to remember that Freemasoney is first and foremost a Fraternity. Members have a right to choose who they want to be around. I have said this many times on the Forum, but people are most often denied membership because one or members have a bad first impression of someone. In our Lodge, most members who are denied are either trying too hard to impress everyone - either with their "knowledge" of Freemasonry, or how cool they think they are. No one wants to voluntarily be around an obnoxious person. I'm not saying this is happening with you, I'm just saying that just because you have been denied does not always mean it's a peoblem with your past. I always tell prospective candidates to listen more than they talk and offer to volunteer while you're waiting. Few lodges will turn down help at a charity event, and it helps show that your intentions are in the right place.
Best of luck. And remember, if this lodge is not right for you today, you might try looking at another one. You can always affiliate with your father’s lodge later.
Hi there.
I hope the brothers here answered your questions. I would like to add one comment: Just because your petition does not go forward does not automatically mean it’s a problem with your past. Sometimes it’s the present. Every lodge is different,and not everyone "fits" with every Lodge. You have to remember that Freemasoney is first and foremost a Fraternity. Members have a right to choose who they want to be around. I have said this many times on the Forum, but people are most often denied membership because one or members have a bad first impression of someone. In our Lodge, most members who are denied are either trying too hard to impress everyone - either with their "knowledge" of Freemasonry, or how cool they think they are. No one wants to voluntarily be around an obnoxious person. I'm not saying this is happening with you, I'm just saying that just because you have been denied does not always mean it's a peoblem with your past. I always tell prospective candidates to listen more than they talk and offer to volunteer while you're waiting. Few lodges will turn down help at a charity event, and it helps show that your intentions are in the right place.
Best of luck. And remember, if this lodge is not right for you today, you might try looking at another one. You can always affiliate with your father’s lodge later.
Bob heruska
Boston. MA
Hi Everyone,
I signed up to say I completely agree with everything Bob said! I’m in the process of becoming a Mason, I have been going to the lodge near my house for 6-7 months. I have a petition, I have had two Mason’s sign it and will be turning it in September 14. Since I have been going to this lodge, I have done nothing but listen to what other members have said. I have asked a few questions, but have mostly been listening. The main thing I have done is, I have gone to their Saturday workdays, where we clean up the lodge for 2-3 hours. Plus, I have gone to the Masonic Teaching nights that the lodge has on every second Tuesday of the month. I have to say, signing up to be a Mason, is the greatest thing I have ever done! They treat me with so much respect, treat me as Brother and I don’t have to worry about someone biting my head off for giving my opinion!
Furthermore, today I went to my first Masonic Funeral, which was very interesting! There were well over 100 plus people just for one man who sounded like a GREAT man! Too bad I didn’t really get a chance to know him. However, I do have to say that new members are showing up right and left at this lodge, most of them are young men wanting to become a Mason.
Have you had your father call some old friends at the lodge and inquire about your rejection? I think it would be easier to address their concerns if you knew what they were. In PA, it used to be one black ball to block a petitioner, now it’s 3 or a trip to the DDGM. Anyway, good luck with your petition.
Nope I have not had my father do that as of yet. Although with the petition that I am getting ready to submit he said he would call some brothers at the lodge. Guess we will see.
Hi there.
I hope the brothers here answered your questions. I would like to add one comment: Just because your petition does not go forward does not automatically mean it’s a problem with your past. Sometimes it’s the present. Every lodge is different,and not everyone "fits" with every Lodge. You have to remember that Freemasoney is first and foremost a Fraternity. Members have a right to choose who they want to be around. I have said this many times on the Forum, but people are most often denied membership because one or members have a bad first impression of someone. In our Lodge, most members who are denied are either trying too hard to impress everyone - either with their "knowledge" of Freemasonry, or how cool they think they are. No one wants to voluntarily be around an obnoxious person. I'm not saying this is happening with you, I'm just saying that just because you have been denied does not always mean it's a peoblem with your past. I always tell prospective candidates to listen more than they talk and offer to volunteer while you're waiting. Few lodges will turn down help at a charity event, and it helps show that your intentions are in the right place.
Best of luck. And remember, if this lodge is not right for you today, you might try looking at another one. You can always affiliate with your father’s lodge later.
Bob heruska
Boston. MA
Hey there the brothers have definately answered my questions. Im going to pick up a petition at the lodge tonight and mail it to my father for him to sign. Im hoping everything will be a go. I really do want to join this lodge and hey if I get turned down I will try again. I hope that they see fit to let me join. Ive talked to several members there and grew up around alot of them. Like I said I know Ive had my mistakes in the past but if they grade me on who I am today then thats all I can ask. The main reason I want to join this lodge is because its the lodge my father belongs too and that means alot to me.
